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mab01
MCR Member
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Posted: Saturday September 15th, 2007 11:26 pm |
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Timo Makinen In-car video (Left foot braking):-
http://www.dailymotion.com/related/1253388/video/xqv6h_timo-makinen-cours-de-talon-pointe_auto
Mini Race/Rally clips video - 'In My Life' Beatles:-
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xqv4c_mini-cooper-en-action
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taffy1967
Member
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Posted: Tuesday September 18th, 2007 02:55 pm |
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Great clips and the top one is slightly different to what appears on my old Mini Cooper Video. I imagine it's from the updated DVD version?
I've seen the second one with The Beatles soundtrack and there really was nothing else like the Mini Cooper and The Beatles.
Almost brings a tear to the eye, damn now I'm getting all sentimental.
 Last edited on Tuesday September 18th, 2007 02:56 pm by taffy1967 |
mab01
MCR Member
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Posted: Tuesday September 18th, 2007 10:47 pm |
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taffy1967 wrote:
Great clips and the top one is slightly different to what appears on my old Mini Cooper Video. I imagine it's from the updated DVD version?
I've seen the second one with The Beatles soundtrack and there really was nothing else like the Mini Cooper and The Beatles.
Almost brings a tear to the eye, damn now I'm getting all sentimental.
I think its the same version as on my 'Flying Finns' DVD.
Your right there really was nothing else like the Mini and The Beatles.......icons from the 60's that can still make you proud to be British!
'In My Life' is also my favourite Beatles song, the words and John Lennons vocals almost bring a tear to the eye for me too.
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taffy1967
Member
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Posted: Wednesday September 19th, 2007 08:57 pm |
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I find it hard to pick a Beatles favourite because I love so many, but the 2 tracks I used to play the most were "Hey Jude" and "I Am The Walrus" because the lyrics used to crack me up!
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PeteC
Member
| Joined: | Saturday September 29th, 2007 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 5 |
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Posted: Tuesday November 20th, 2007 11:35 pm |
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The first video 'Timo Makinen cours de talon pointe' is a clip from the Castrol Film 'The Flying Finns' released by Castrol in about 1968! What you don't see here is the comparitively easy time Hannu Mikkola had in the Works Escort over the same stage! The writing was on the wall for the Mini sad to say!!! Still a great piece of in-car footage though, and action that surely spurs a lot of us on nearly 40 years later.
I remember seeing it at the Racing Car Show at Olympia, (where it was premiered) and I suspect it is still available from someone as it was put onto video by Castrol in the 80's. The original was cinema quality in 35mm film, so projected really well onto a big screen. Castrol produced an annual film which lasted about 45minutes, and was eagerly awaited by car clubs. It usually formed a 'centre piece' annually for a noggin and natter night. Later in the 60's and 70's I was on the MGCC Midland Centre Committee and our chairman was influential in Castrol. We premiered the latest Castrol film 2 years running, with over 200 attending the club nights to see the films. Now those were the days!
I'm not sure of the origins of the second clip, but I have seen them before somewhere! Perhaps someone else can help!
PeteC
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taffy1967
Member
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Posted: Wednesday November 21st, 2007 11:25 am |
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I'd say the writing was on the wall when British Leyland took control, but the Mini could still have been allowed to compete even if it wasn't going to be the winner any more?
Anyway I'd still rather drive a nice Mini than a tin can Escort.
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618AOG
Member
| Joined: | Tuesday March 14th, 2006 |
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| Posts: | 205 |
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Posted: Monday November 26th, 2007 07:56 pm |
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You must be joking. An Escort Twin Cam would eat a Mini alive, a much better car as was the Mexico and the fabulous RS1600. It's called 'progress' I believe.
Sorry mate but you need to own a proper Cooper S before you can call Escorts 'tin cans'
The Mini Cooper died a death because it was finished. Better cars came along, simple as that.
Anyway, there were better bands out there than the Beatles who made some good records but an awful lot of crap. The Stones were vastly better along with The Animals, The Who, The Doors, The Beach Boys..................
The Beatles were just a bit too 'soft'. My faves are 'Day in The Life' and 'Get Back'. Neither compare though to 'The End' by the Doors for example.Last edited on Monday November 26th, 2007 08:01 pm by 618AOG |
taffy1967
Member
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Posted: Monday November 26th, 2007 11:33 pm |
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Oh god if I'd wanted a proper Cooper S I'd have bought one. Instead I wanted a small family car that was also fun and didn't pretend to be anything more than a hot Mini.
As for the Escort, well an old friends older brothers used to run around in a variety of them over the years and I really didn't like them one little bit.
I couldn't care a stuff if they were faster or more progressive, because Minis are really something else.
Oh and I might not be old enough to remember the 1960's, but you can quote just about any band from the Spencer Davies Group to Pink Floyd and I've probably got an album or two. In fact I've got all The Doors back catalogue on vinyl.
I wouldn't really call The Beatles soft, because they were inspiring just like the Mini and they encouraged just about everyone else to pick up a guitar and make it big. Tracks like "Tomorrow Never Knows" or "I Am The Walrus" are very much out there and so is a lot of the "White Album".
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618AOG
Member
| Joined: | Tuesday March 14th, 2006 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 205 |
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Posted: Thursday November 29th, 2007 10:00 am |
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taffy1967 wrote:
Oh god if I'd wanted a proper Cooper S I'd have bought one. Instead I wanted a small family car that was also fun and didn't pretend to be anything more than a hot Mini.
Then why didn't you? The old 'I could have.........' doesn't cut it really.
I had a proper Cooper S and a 1.6 205GTi as an everyday car, the latter of which was far more of a Cooper replacement than the later Rover Cooper. For a start it actually had 'performance' which you don't really get with 60 bhp. When it was new there wasn't really anything like the Peugeot. It also had 5 gears and the most incredible handling plus crap trim and the odd rattle. That's why the 205GTi is a legend 15 years after the last one was built. Nobody really built anything comparable save perhaps the Clio Williams which was faster but a lot more money.
As for Escorts - not everyone can drive a rear drive car so don't feel cut up about not liking them. RS1600's are now making £25'000 (even Mexicos are touching 10 grand now) so it's kind of irrelevant anyway.
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taffy1967
Member
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Posted: Thursday November 29th, 2007 03:49 pm |
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Then why didn't you? The old 'I could have.........' doesn't cut it really.
Probably because I didn't particularly want to own a museum piece that I'd be too afraid to use and worried that even the slightest imperfection would bring me nothing but grief from certain people (like you perhaps?) at the National Mini Cooper Day @ Beaulieu.
And I'd feel guilty for not spending every waking hour washing and polishing it like someone with an obsessive compulsive cleaning disorder.
No I bought my 1990 Rover Mini Cooper back in early 1994 for a very nice price and I've used and enjoyed it ever since which is how it should be. For almost a decade it was our main family car and after all these years I'm really not complaining because it's been a great little car.
I had a proper Cooper S and a 1.6 205GTi as an everyday car, the latter of which was far more of a Cooper replacement than the later Rover Cooper. For a start it actually had 'performance' which you don't really get with 60 bhp. When it was new there wasn't really anything like the Peugeot. It also had 5 gears and the most incredible handling plus crap trim and the odd rattle. That's why the 205GTi is a legend 15 years after the last one was built. Nobody really built anything comparable save perhaps the Clio Williams which was faster but a lot more money.
But that's just it, the Rover Cooper doesn't pretend to be a Cooper S because it isn't a Cooper S. It's simply a go faster Mini, which was exactly what the original Mini Cooper was back in 1961 and it was also very good value for money too.
Yes 60bhp isn't a lot, but after losing the cat, fitting a sports exhaust and LCB manifold and a suitable air filter I'm sure that mine is pumping out considerably more. In fact the basic John Cooper Conversion kits that were available to boost the performance of most Rover Coopers pushed them beyond that of an original 1275S. More so if you chose the 1400S conversion.
We've already thrashed this one out before on another thread, but which ever way you look at it the Rover Cooper was a great deal of fun for little money (until BMW stepped in of course).
Prior to that you had to pay specialist companies like Paul Huxford ludicrous sums of money to own one of his retro looking Mini Coopers. Then in 1990 you could buy a brand new Cooper from Rover for less than half the price, so why complain now?
As for Escorts - not everyone can drive a rear drive car so don't feel cut up about not liking them. RS1600's are now making £25'000 (even Mexicos are touching 10 grand now) so it's kind of irrelevant anyway.
I don't and I've just never been a fan, although I did once own an Escort XR3i, but I lost interest after the insurance got silly and the novelty of high performance on cars like that soon wore off too.
Where as all real Minis appeal to me because I get a real buzz from driving them at most speeds anyway. That way I'll also stand a better chance of hanging on to my driving licence too.
Well unless they start installing speed camera's on the mountain roads here that is?
Last edited on Thursday November 29th, 2007 03:52 pm by taffy1967 |
618AOG
Member
| Joined: | Tuesday March 14th, 2006 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 205 |
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Posted: Thursday November 29th, 2007 05:28 pm |
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taffy1967 wrote:
Then why didn't you? The old 'I could have.........' doesn't cut it really.
Probably because I didn't particularly want to own a museum piece that I'd be too afraid to use and worried that even the slightest imperfection would bring me nothing but grief from certain people (like you perhaps?) at the National Mini Cooper Day @ Beaulieu.
Do you not have a garage? Why would you be too afraid to drive an original S? I wasn't afraid to use any of mine. It's only a car. You don't have to own a 101% perfect S to gain respect although there are some real idiots out there who will bicker over small details.
I personally wouldn't entertain a Mini for everday use. Maybe 20 years ago, but I'm somewhat wiser now. I find a BMW 320d does the job nicely.
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618AOG
Member
| Joined: | Tuesday March 14th, 2006 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 205 |
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Posted: Thursday November 29th, 2007 05:28 pm |
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taffy1967 wrote:
Then why didn't you? The old 'I could have.........' doesn't cut it really.
Probably because I didn't particularly want to own a museum piece that I'd be too afraid to use and worried that even the slightest imperfection would bring me nothing but grief from certain people (like you perhaps?) at the National Mini Cooper Day @ Beaulieu.
Do you not have a garage? Why would you be too afraid to drive an original S? I wasn't afraid to use any of mine. It's only a car. You don't have to own a 101% perfect S to gain respect although there are some real idiots out there who will bicker over small details.
I personally wouldn't entertain a Mini for everday use. Maybe 20 years ago, but I'm somewhat wiser now. I find a BMW 320d does the job nicely.
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PeteC
Member
| Joined: | Saturday September 29th, 2007 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 5 |
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Posted: Thursday November 29th, 2007 07:46 pm |
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Wow! I didn't realise what I was starting here, or perhaps, adding fuel to would be more accurate.
Perhaps we should remember that the Mini Cooper S was THE rally car between 1963 and 1968, mostly thanks to the inherent handling qualities of the basic design and the car also getting brakes and an engine that could live with the demands of rallies (and races) at that time. Also the Boys at Abingdon played a special role in being able to screw the thing together really well and get servicing organised in way that took other teams by surprise.
But things move on and unfortunately the small wheels, narrow track and low(ish) power output, and poor ground clearance made the late 1960's a Lancia domain. The 1970s through to early 1980s the Ford era and of course since then we have seen the Group B cars, the Subaru's, Mitsubishi, Citroen and Ford (again) all rise to dominate. I have to remind people sometimes that the Mini Cooper in the 1960s was the best World Rally Car and was as dominant with drivers just as good as Loeb, Citroen etc are today. And some events lasted for 4 or 5 days almost non stop!
Incidentally, I view my Cooper as a means to an end. I bought it because I didn't buy one in my youth (although I did have an 848cc Mini Super delux) and thought I might have missed something good. The means to an end is to provide some fun, so it has been built to be a Minis to Monte type car and possibly for road rallies which I enjoyed in the 1980s with (dare I mention it again) an RS Ford.
I've had quite a few cars, most of which have now gained classic status, but the one for me was a Toyota Corolla GT. This is a car none of the classic magazines list (but they do list the Mark 1 MR2) when only 2,500 came into the UK and most were used in racing or rallying, and sad to say many of the remaining cars have now fallen into the hands of 'Drifters'! If you can find one that hasn't been molested or rotted away then buy it, and use on the days the Cooper won't start!!!
Also I too would not like to see speed cameras on mountain roads. I suspect we won't as the potential for revenue would be too low. To link to another forum topic relating to Geoff Mabbs - doesn't he still hold the fastest time ever recorded on the Farmers Road? In a Cooper S as well.
Cheers
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taffy1967
Member
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Posted: Thursday November 29th, 2007 11:44 pm |
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618AOG wrote:
taffy1967 wrote:
Then why didn't you? The old 'I could have.........' doesn't cut it really.
Probably because I didn't particularly want to own a museum piece that I'd be too afraid to use and worried that even the slightest imperfection would bring me nothing but grief from certain people (like you perhaps?) at the National Mini Cooper Day @ Beaulieu.
Do you not have a garage? Why would you be too afraid to drive an original S? I wasn't afraid to use any of mine. It's only a car. You don't have to own a 101% perfect S to gain respect although there are some real idiots out there who will bicker over small details.
I personally wouldn't entertain a Mini for everday use. Maybe 20 years ago, but I'm somewhat wiser now. I find a BMW 320d does the job nicely.
I have a garage now, but back in 1994 I didn't and so for many years our Mini Cooper lived on the road outside our house.
We don't use ours for everyday use now, although if it was required then I'd have no hesitation because it's always been a good solid and reliable car.
I suppose that as it's now garaged and treated like another family pet, then a real Mini Cooper S could fill it's shoes. But we've now grown so attached to this car that we wouldn't want to part with it. Plus it does everything a hot Mini is supposed to do and that includes putting a silly grin on our faces anyway.
I'm now more used to driving a Zafira, so driving the Mini with no power steering and it's go-kart handling is fantastic.
So I'm more than happy that I can have my cake and eat it when I want, (so to speak).
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DaveShreeve
Administrator
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Posted: Thursday November 29th, 2007 11:53 pm |
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I think this discussion is well covered by comments in Autosport's freebie 'Rally Ireland and Wales Rally GB 2007' Their top 10 of RAC cars places the S at 6 and the Mark II RS1800 at number 1. However, the composer points out that not a single WRC car features and 'it's just that the passing of time has made my chosen 10 even better than they probably ever were'.
The fact is the Escort had a usable international rally period about twice the length of the S and seems to still have more opportunities for use in the clubman world. It's a case of what else was available in the era and the amount of development put in by the manufacturer.
In terms of daily use the first decision has to be, how much room you want in a car? If a mini fits with what you need there's not much point buying anything larger especially if you regularly drive narrow roads, or have restricted parking space. Having known someone who tried to run a Broadspeed Twin Cam Escort MkI as daily transport I'd stick with an S; 5days to work and back and then a weekend in the garage getting it to run cleanly again isn't particularly convenient. Ask his then girlfriend. S's can be awkward but in regular use a tickle once a month should keep things happy. In todays world I'd suggest the mini's the one for the fun drive, the grin appears at much lower speeds which has to be good thing.
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Glen Ponder
MCR Member
| Joined: | Sunday November 13th, 2005 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 845 |
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Posted: Sunday December 16th, 2007 07:47 pm |
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This chap took some nice colour footage at race circuits in the late 60's, it's quite grainy , even more so after being uploaded but worth a look.
http://www.youtube.com/profile_videos?user=DrBGW&p=r
'Bulee' 07
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=FmcBxiK0yg0&feature=related
Production line footage..
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=5mxbUrkDZ34&NR=1
Last edited on Sunday December 16th, 2007 07:52 pm by Glen Ponder |
Glen Ponder
MCR Member
| Joined: | Sunday November 13th, 2005 |
| Location: | |
| Posts: | 845 |
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Posted: Sunday December 16th, 2007 08:23 pm |
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Nice Ozzy saloon car action here.....
http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=LZiQ4PJSmyo&feature=related
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taffy1967
Member
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Posted: Thursday January 10th, 2008 11:55 pm |
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618AOG wrote:
taffy1967 wrote:
Oh god if I'd wanted a proper Cooper S I'd have bought one. Instead I wanted a small family car that was also fun and didn't pretend to be anything more than a hot Mini.
Then why didn't you? The old 'I could have.........' doesn't cut it really.
I had a proper Cooper S and a 1.6 205GTi as an everyday car, the latter of which was far more of a Cooper replacement than the later Rover Cooper. For a start it actually had 'performance' which you don't really get with 60 bhp. When it was new there wasn't really anything like the Peugeot. It also had 5 gears and the most incredible handling plus crap trim and the odd rattle. That's why the 205GTi is a legend 15 years after the last one was built. Nobody really built anything comparable save perhaps the Clio Williams which was faster but a lot more money.
As for Escorts - not everyone can drive a rear drive car so don't feel cut up about not liking them. RS1600's are now making £25'000 (even Mexicos are touching 10 grand now) so it's kind of irrelevant anyway.
That was taken from the April 1991 issue of the MCR Magazine and here's a plethora of road tests done on the early Rover Mini Cooper and it was just as well received by the motoring journalists as the original Cooper had been some 30 years earlier: -
http://z11.invisionfree.com/mainstreamcooper/index.php?showforum=12
Plus classic adverts such as: -
Or you could have paid more than twice the money to Paul Huxford for one of his instead:-
So now tell me which one is better value for money, just like the original Mini Cooper?
Last edited on Friday January 11th, 2008 12:04 am by taffy1967 |
Mk 3 S Meister
MCR Member
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Posted: Friday January 11th, 2008 08:14 am |
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| Praise the Lord - another pointless thread resurrection.
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Mk 3 S Meister
MCR Member
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Posted: Friday January 11th, 2008 08:14 am |
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| Praise the Lord - another pointless thread resurrection.
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